Mark Shuttleworth opens his mouth again ……… and this time it was sharp.
One day after the release of Ubuntu 13.10 and Ubuntu Phone, Mark on his website posts among other things his thanks to those who collaborated with both projects, how proud he is of Ubuntu Phone and an invitation to collaborate with ideas for version 14.04, which will be called Trusty Tahr (it is a goat that lives in the mountains of the Himalayas) .
But the pearl that points Phoronix are his comments to the detractors of Mir, which has been running on Ubuntu Phone and is expected for 14.04, even though its compatibility version was not included in 13.10. I quote (translations of metalbyte, Tannhausser and me):
Mir is a very important job. When a lot of competitors attack a project for purely political reasons, you have to wonder what their agenda is. At least now we know who belongs to the Open Source Tea Party. And to put all the fuss in context: Mir is relevant to about 1% of all developers, those who think about shell development. Any application developer will consume Mir through its toolkit. By contrast, those same outraged individuals suffer from NIH on every piece of the pile they get their hands on… especially SystemD, which is highly invasive and hardly justified. How close I see Canonical's competitors torturing the English language in their efforts to justify how those tools should support Windows, but not Mir. But we're going to do it, and it's going to be amazing.
I can tell you what the Mir team's agenda is: speed, quality, reliability, efficiency. That. From what I've seen on the smartphone, Mir is going to be a huge leap forward for next-gen gaming performance, battery life, and display capabilities. So thanks for the many contributions to Mir, and to everyone who tries it out in environments more challenging than the smartphone. I'm enjoying it on my laptop and I love the native Mir gaming benchmarks. So to the team, and the larger community that helps test and refine Mir, thank you.
…………… .What do they tell me? First of all, we must clarify: The Tea Party it is a movement in favor of reducing state spending, the national debt and taxes. But since many of those who participate in that movement are conservatives like Sarah Palin (there are also many libertarians like Ron Paul), outside the US they are seen as crazy looks.
The answers soon arrived. This was the Lennart Poettering (creator of systemd, and another being hated in the linuxsphere)
And yes, I'm not entirely sure what he's saying, but I think some "outraged individuals" from "especially SystemD" have been called the "Open Source Tea Party" by Mark.
I wonder how we deserve such praise. I haven't publicly commented on Ubuntu and Canonical on my blog in years. And I don't think he said much about Mir. Yes, I can say that Upstart is poorly designed, but that's a technical opinion, and heck, another one that I don't care about ...
(Also, I think Matthew Garrett has posted on his blog probably the most relevant reviews of Mir's situation, but I find it ingenious to suggest that he would torture the English language. I mean, you can complain about my English, but heck, Matthew is from Cambridge…)
Then came the one of aaron sego which in a summarized and challenging way said (Tannhausser's translation):
As one of the people who has disagreed with Mir's need and worth, as well as the practice of spreading lies in his defense, it bothers me that I am equated with a political movement, which does not resemble the related issues with Mir. I am particularly offended by the suggestion that the only reply to Mir has been politically motivated. This amounts to slander at worst, and insults at best. I would not accept it being done to you, yet it does it to others. It's your fault, Mark, what a shame.[…] My answer to that is simple, Mark: we are going to do this as adults. If you want to discuss Mir and the "slander" of those who disagree, we will do so live and online, as for example on the Linux Action Show videocast by Chris Fisher and Matt Hartley.
Yes, I am challenging you to a public debate on the matter. It seems appropriate since you perceive it as a political issue.
Another that would also challenge him is Martin Grasslin (KWin developer):
I love that part of Mark Shuttleworth's blog post (referring to English torture). A good personal attack on all those who did not have the opportunity to be born in a country whose main language is English. But I would challenge Mark to a duel in the most natively spoken language in Europe 😉 It would be nice to see Jono Bacon explaining to me how I shouldn't feel oppressed by that sentence. Oh and of course I know my problems with English.
The Windows part is also good. Since I once said to maintainers of KDE for Windows: "I am proud to keep the only part of KDE that can never be ported to Windows" and that our mission clearly excludes non-Unix OS.
And I say. A duel between Mark and Jono against Martin and Aaron would be interesting. Let's wait and see what Mark says.
Update: What you just wrote is not wasted Jono bacon.
51 comments, leave yours
This situation is red hot, the interesting thing is coming in the 2014 Ubuntu 14.04 LTS with or without a mirror, it will talk a lot
Haha, I would love to see that duel, and Mark doesn't know what to criticize anymore? .. now criticizing the non-native language of a person, what the hell does he do?
I hope that mir comes out ahead, not because it is an open source development, but not for anything else.
»Mark no longer knows what to criticize? .. now criticizing the non-“Native” language of a person, what the hell does he do? »
I am one of those who tortured the English language, but not to troll Ubuntu haha. It is difficult although I handle a little. More than anything technical English.
Thanks for the link from jono
Yay let's follow Jono's lead and do #FriendlyFriday! xDD
Seriously, here is something quite interesting because it would be a full stop for a Mark - Aaron debate in the world of GNU / Linux.
In fact, I think that as an official GNU / Linux flamer, Shuttleworth just brags about making vaporware, and the truth is that it is a hassle to have to respond to provocations.
And extracting part of the Shuttleworth translation:
Hello Mark! X has already evolved and is called Wayland!
Sorry for what I'll say in English, but are you really fucking sure that all of the contributors are dependents of Google Translate and / or Bing Translator ?! Come on! You're worse that Steve Ballmer as CEO.
* Sorry for the Management by Perkele., but a brief relief was necessary.
What it is trying to say is that many people are juggling to support dependencies and windows programs but LOOK IS A SIN. that's what it's about.
Mark shakes the hornet's nest, creating tension and controversy. A few hours later the free software community jumps up and dismantles their arguments, and then Jono from fire extinguisher appears, to try to solve the boss's gaffes, as if nothing happened here ...
We have already seen that movie many times 🙂
PS Thanks Diazepan for the mention, you owe me an Open Source Tea Party T-shirt, that you know XD
I can't remember the last time Mark said something and didn't wave a hornet's nest ¬_¬
It's a sadness that this bigmouth only does that. There is talk of what Canonical plans to do in Ubuntu but nothing is concrete, and along the way, both distro and users are throwing themselves at detractors of free by the language of this South African idiot.
That he dedicates himself to working and herding his employees and free developers as Torvalds does, because in each launch they end up removing things because they were not ready. Today we already know that Unity 8 will not even reach 14.04, let's see if it leaves for 14.10, and at the rate they are going, MIR does not reach the LTS either. And on the other hand, as the days go by, more and more programs are abandoning gtk and going to Qt in the best of cases, if not even disappearing. And Canonical still doesn't release their own versions like Gnome, Elementary, Pear, etc.
I think it's bad that Mark criticizes the way he expresses himself - not having good English - and not the message itself. That would be a personal attack. But why is Aaron Seigo offended if they tell him he had political reasons? it should not be confused with "party politics." In many professions it can be used: "company policy" "criminal policy." If you don't agree (like some of us) with Mark's decisions or ideas, they go to another distro, create another graphic server or put together another movement - that word also offends you. That is a form of politics. It is known that software went from being something of a laboratory for engineers and programmers to something more social - there are even states that promote it - so there may be conflicts and motivations beyond the technical.
That the Tea Party are seen as "crazy" is adding fuel to the fire. What I imagine Mark wanted to highlight with this is "conservative" or "reactionary" in some way. Which is partly right.
The "tea party" I think is a direct reference to "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland" and in that story the "tea party" are crazy.
The Tea Party is the conservative party in the US, Mark was referring to that concept, preferring to stay stuck on the X server instead of moving forward. I agree and disagree with Mark. You have to change to Xs, but not in an almost proprietary implementation like Mir.
And with regard to "crazy faces", I must say that fascism is not located in a specific spectrum of politics or thought (conservative in this case), there were left-wing fascists, Mussolini, Pol Pot and Kim Jong-Un are examples of it.
Within the two-dimensional political spectrum, fascism is within the socially conservative-economically moderate. Pol Pot and Kim Jong Un are economically conservative (despotism).
"... when you go far enough to the right, you see the same fools coming from the left"
but we already had Wayland as an evolution of X and it works well, why not continue using it ... or simply the idea of Canonical is to kill whatever project is not created by them ¬¬
And where did Canonical kill Wayland? D:
I rather think it refers to the mad hatter and company.
I think the people of KDE have seen the problems with mir, we will see what happens with Ubuntu 14.04 that for the rest this will be lts ...
That Mark is quite a flamer. In addition, what he would need to do is criticize Stallman and the flame would reach stratospheric levels.
And are there still those who think that diversity does not cause fractures and, therefore, fragmentation within the GNU / Linux world?
Mark Shuttleworth is one of the few real exceptions that really demonstrates a real divide in the GNU / Linux universe. Also, depending on how he expresses himself, it really shows that he is an innate flamer.
Linus Trovals is also somewhat flamboyant, but in himself he knows how to justify without necessarily vulgarly humiliate someone (now, that many of us imitate the philosophy management by perkele, it really depends on a self-analysis to be able to realize that the excess of it can be harmful to the reputation of each one of us (as}).
No fractures occur yet. Fractures will occur when Ubuntu becomes Apple (which is not difficult to do)
But if Apple doesn't care what Cannonical does, so if Cannonical really wanted to be like Apple, they would have adopted eOS and sent Ubuntu to hell.
one thing is diversity and another is to take out of the bag a new project that is only compatible with my product, in that case if it is fragment
Those of the Tea Party are seen as Crazy Faces also within the USA, it is not necessary more than to see a Bill Maher program.
And this is nothing more than Ubuntu Phone and Ubuntu propaganda disguised as controversy.
By the way Ubuntu phone with MIR is on the street. When will we see another distro but with Wayland on the phones?
Bill Maher is on the sidewalk opposite the tea party, that's why he calls them crazy looks. The same with CNN.
Not exactly a distro, but its base is free like any distro, I mean Sailfish OS, it uses Wayland and it works very well.
Tizen and Sailfish use Wayland.
Arch uses it too.
If he accepts the duel, I think I'll get a supply of Coke Zero and microwave popcorn XD
Blood, Blood !!! A lie, but uuuuuuhhh Blood, Blood !!!
The English thing seems Ridiculous to me with R for Resentful and Repressed.
Let Mir take off without much show, to demonstrate with facts that if it is as good as it says, this already looks like vaporware.
Damn, I feel worse every day. I thank you for creating Ubuntu that allowed me to get into Linux and I admire the goal of confluence with the increasingly dominant, touch world. But the end does not justify the means. Since a certain version Ubuntu has only gotten worse. Right now it's an increasingly heavy hodgepodge of technologies. With how wonderful it would have been to continue side by side with Gnome, achieve a capital distro…. and then consider the phones and tablets. Instead we have come across unfinished work on the desk and all these controversies. The guy bigger than the ass, just like the phone. To this day, there is hardly any talk, with each launch, of whether Ubuntu starts better, if that or the other has been corrected, if it has better artwork… .. It seems that only Unity exists. The roof will seem beautiful to many, but the foundation of a house should not be neglected. And the foundation remains unpolished and unpolished.
We want blood !!!!!!!!!! Let them kill themselves hahaha, the truth is, fuck Mark, I would have seen Linus's opinion hahahaha.
to the truth that this guy has hit the next name because he is the one who is like a GOAT
I think that by trotting the English language, it means that they are constantly insulating
Where is Mir? Where is Wayland? When I test them then, I can make an opinion for or against.
I don't know why many people are for or against something they haven't even tried.
Here users seem more religious than users, they argue and offend for something they have not tried "at least I have not tried any" if someone knows how they tell me.
But my personal opinion is that there should not be an inclination for either of the two sides since, both Mir and Wayland can coexist and also maybe Wayland is better but, if it is not? What would happen if Mir is better than Wayland but the lack of Intel support brings it down? I believe that in GNU / LINUX diversity is a virtue and if we only depend on a graphical server for everything, it can be bad as well as good.
Advice: We better wait for the two results and so we can say and choose which one suits us according to our needs.
Meanwhile in MICROSOFT they must be with the last grinding wheel.
Wayland is already on Arch replacing X.org; MIR is the one that is not even being seriously tested.
Wayland is on Arch's stable repos, but it doesn't replace X's in any way.
Nothing like lighting the curtains in the living room with a match to attract attention. Shuttleworth has been begging for months to be fought since his fiasco in the Ubuntu Phone pre-sale, unfortunately he always succeeds because he seeks to provoke the holy men and purists of SL who of course shout and tear their clothes asking for stoning against the bastard son of Debian (Ubuntu ) and his pseudo aspiring Apple CEO Mark "the Goat" Shuttleworth. And if there is someone fascist and neo-Nazi in the SL, it is precisely him: the young man gets angry because they criticize his useless toys (MIR, Unity) made of steam, unfinished and unpolished that nobody uses or will use.
Not to offend GNU supporters, but the Hurd microkernel, gnash, and also other FSF projects are also considered vaporware.
He himself is the official flamboyant of GNU / Linux.
+ limit of x ^ x with x tending to infinity.
hahaha ... Mark Shuttleworth likes to sell smoke ... if it is so good, watch him prove it and stop throwing sh * t ... at others.
A few days ago I recorded a video explaining the Wayland VS Mir theme, in case you are interested: http://youtu.be/6QMe5cL14ss
I think both parties are right, and therefore Canonical has the right to create MIR